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Video: Market Trends with Matt Grbcic from Ray White Broadbeach

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James sits down with Matt Grbcic from MG Group to chat all things project management.

In this interview James and Matt chat about:

  • The construct process
  • Tips for people starting out on their property journey
  • Top 3 tips for people building their first home
  • What project managers and quantity surveyors do
  • Plus so much more!

Read on below for the full transcription of our interview:

– Hello everybody, James from mrkts.com.au here, and today we’re are blessed to be joined by a Mr. Matt Grbcic, from the MG Group. Hello Matt, how are you?

– Good mate, how are you?

– Matt’s been in the… I’m well, thank you. Matt’s been in the industry for over twelve years, learning from all of the walks of management life. Project management, development management, and superintendent roles. So, today we’re going to learn a little bit more about the intricacies of those roles, and any of the tips he’s learned over the twelve years. Does that sound…

– Sounds pretty good, mate.

– I’m sure we can try.

– Soon have a go.

– So, the start of every interview, we want to try and get an idea of where you’re from, what your background is, so your CV in under one minute, if possible.

– Okay. Well, I’ve been doing work, I’ve been doing surveying, since 18 years old. I was lucky enough to have a couple good mentors, as project management mentors. And, I’ve actually been lucky enough to work with some really good developers, so really seasoned business guys. So, I’ve been able to learn under their wings. MG Group is my company, we specialize in project management, superintendent and develop management services. Also quantity surveying, and we have been going for five years now.

– Then, what is a project manager, and what is it that they do?

– So, I think project management has a very broad term, in the industry. The way that I view it, with what we do, is specific to commercial development. A project manager, I suppose, manages the role throughout construction, from start of construction, through the end of construction, anything related to construction. So, whether it’s design, approvals, and best for the construction process. So, I guess that’s a very sort of broad analogy of what we do.

– I’m feeling, probably, the names aren’t as misleading as you think they are. So, project management, if you break it down into project and management, that’s what you’re doing. Single project that’s selected, and then you are managing that process, and on the client’s behalf, normally, getting them all the way to the end.

– That’s what we do, yeah. So, if you look at a single project, the project needs an approval, it needs design, it needs contracts, and there’s the whole management of the construction period. So, it’s, yeah, I guess the way I view it as a project manager, manages that construction process.

– And it’s important to be specific, because in the other one you mentioned, was development manager, so there are differences there.

– Yeah, there are, and I guess there’s different definitions to it, but the way I view it, and the way we offer our services, is a development manager will go outside the box to a project manager a little bit, and look at sales and marketing, finance, and other aspects of the site, outside of the construction process.

– So, more encompassing of the entire development, probably.

– Yeah, that’s a pretty good way to explain it.

– Then a superintendent, as you mentioned before, what do they do?

– A superintendent, so, in the construction contact between a developer and a builder, there needs to be a third party. That third party is what you call a superintendent, and he’s referenced in the contracts. So, we sit in the middle, generally, between the developer and the builder, and act as a third party. So, the payment claims, disputes, variations, EFTs. Anything to do with the contract that needs to be administered, that’s the superintendent’s role.

– Okay. So, you’re the mediator, sitting between two parties?

– At times, yeah.

– At times, okay, yeah. Because it’s not always butting heads, it’s people are agreeing to things?

– Absolutely, and the way we manage projects, I suppose, we do things a bit differently to avoid the risk of butting heads.

– Of the headbutting.

– Yeah.

– Okay, excellent. They’re the three main roles. You did also mention quantity surveying, so let’s get a little bit of a rundown on that one, as well.

– Okay, so a quantity surveyor is someone who measures and prices buildings. So, they have their… They measure every element of the building, and apply the cost rates to each element. And, therefore, you get a cost plan, a bill of qualities, cost estimate.

– So, what scale do you require a quantity surveyor, what size of building?

– I mean, that’s a pretty good question. I have a different perspective to other people in the industry about this but I think that if a quantity surveyor can add value to your process, and then my answer is you should use one. And, what that means is that if you’re unsure about something or you want someone to run their eyes over a costing, then I think you should use one. So, I think you can use it from any size project, provided it’s going to add value and help you accomplish what you’re gonna accomplish.

– So, like with any of the roles or when people need someone who’s in your position that can cover these roles, I suppose the main question they should always ask themselves is, “Is there value in me getting this help?”

– “Is there something I don’t know?”

– And that’s, you know, “Is there a hole that needs to be filled?” And, like I say, you don’t know what you don’t know. So, if you aren’t sure, or if it’s your first project, it’s not going to hurt to have a conversation with someone who’s a bit more of an expert in the field.

– And when selecting an individual, what would you recommend people do before going, “Right, well this is my man… “Or lady.”

– Yeah, that’s a good question. So, for us, when clients are sort of vetting us, they’ll check my credibility, they’ll also call my other clients, they’ll obviously check my price and my scope, and make sure…

– You’re in the ballpark, at least.

– I’m in the ballpark, I mean, that’s obviously very important. You’ve got to feel comfortable with who you’re about to do business with. You’ve got to be able to know, like and trust the person you’re about to do business with. So, that’s how I look at things. I know that’s how some of the developers we work with looked at it when they were hiring me for the first time, so that’s my advice.

– I know you’ve done a lot of work all over the place, because it’s not just in Australia. There was work overseas, as well.

– Yeah, we’ve done a bit of work in Southeast Asia.

– Wow, exciting. And they do things very differently.

– Very differently, yeah.

– It’s good experience.

– It’s incredible experience, yeah.

– Let’s try and run through that process, from start to finish. Well, to the best of your knowledge, the construction process, if they were building their home, what is the process and what do they need to be thinking about?

– Okay, so just basically… Pretty in detail. Obviously, you’re going to buy your block, your block of land. So there will be some initial… It’ll be obviously your design process. So, you’ll have your design process is then split up in to a number of different disciplines. So, you architects, your structural engineer, or your services consultants, the list goes on.

– So, you’ve found the land, you know now, or you’ve designed what you want to see on that land, and now what happens?

– You’ll need your approvals, as well. So, you’ll need your DA, your BA, and any compliance payments. So, you’ll have to go through that process. Your DA will stipulate what compliance payments you require, and there will be a whole bunch of authority costs, as well. So, you’ll have, obviously, whether it’s home or any insurance, portable long-service leave, so you’ll have to go through and tick those boxes. And you’ll tender your project out to a couple of builders.

– Which basically means seek quotes.

– Seek quotes, yeah.

– And going to tender, and that means–

– Yeah, you could.

– We would always recommend five, personally. This is for the people at home. When you’re trying to decide on who you want to build with, speak to three to five builders, if you can.

– I think that if it’s your first job, and you’re doing it by yourself, I think so.

– 100 percent.

– I think so, yeah. I think that’s pretty solid rec…

– So, we’ve now got the designs, the approval process is in place, you’ve tended the builder and you think you know who you want, and it’s ready to go. So, now what do we do?

– Draw up a construction contract, and enter the construction phase. Sign the construction contract with you builder, then off you go. I mean, that’s a very simplistic view of the process, and there’s modifications to it, but yeah, that’s the most simplistic view of it.

– And throughout the build, it’s managed… Generally, my assumption is, understanding that we do more on the development side, which is a little bit larger than the one house at a time, but if somebody’s doing their own home, there will be a project manager with the master builder that they’ve allocated, or the builder they have chosen will have a project manager that’s tied into the job.

– From the builder’s side.

– From the builder’s side.

– And that’s where some of the confusion comes, because a lot of times, on the smaller jobs specifically, like you’re referring to, clients will say, “Yeah, but I’ve already got a project manager.” But, he’s representing the builder. So, especially where things are at now in the industry, I think having a project manager that represents you can add a lot of benefit.

– So, known as client-side, right?

– Client-side, yeah.

– So then, a client-side PM, project manager, that can fight in your corner, should things go the way that you hope they don’t, which is most businesses is a very big potential. There will be something that trips everybody up, and it’s about working together to get to a common goal.

– Yeah, I guess, it’s just protecting your downside, it’s as simple as that.

– Which you’ve got to factor in.

– You do. So, you know, you’ve just got to weigh it up. So, if it’s going to cost you 5000-1000 dollars, have an extra set of eyes over the job, what’s that potentially going to save you if something goes wrong. So, like I said with all our clients, and again, a lot of our clients are developers, and small commercial development on a bigger scale, but it’s like with anything. It’s about protecting you risk, and it’s about going into something as risk-free as possible, and in my view and the way I view things, that’s the name of the game.

– Yeah, very important, very important. Once again, in the position that most of our members are in, you would say do your numbers, do your figures. And then if you can contemplate the fact that there will be a fee attached to having a project manager, this will be the benefit that I see. There may be a fee attached to having a client-side project manager, however you then weigh it up to the fact that he will find something, or he will likely catch something that you will not see, that will save you more than his fee in the long run, right?

– Yeah, and that’s the conversation I have, exactly, with clients, as well. They’re saying, “Great mate, we’ve got your fee, “and you want to be a project manager, “but where are you going to add value?” So, my answer to that question is get a project manager on if it’s going to add value. Don’t do it just for the sake of it, but if there’s something you’re not sure about or if there’s a hole in your knowledge, if there’s a knowledge gap, essentially. Yeah, it’s something worth contemplating, I think.

– Something for the investors, as well, because will have people… Well, we have been speaking to members who have purchased a property, they’re already living in their home, so they’ve got their main residence, that’s what it’s called now, some principal place. Main residence.

– Main residence.

– And they’ve bought their second property. And it needs… The bathroom needs a touch-up, and the kitchen needs some work, but that’s about it, and they’re ready to go. On those little reno jobs, they’ll probably save themselves time and money, in the long-run, if they have somebody there that understands the process in it’s entirety.

– Yeah, possibly, or at least have a coffee with someone. For the smaller jobs…

– Or, join Mrkts group, and ask the question, and maybe Matt will be nice enough to throw some advice your way.

– Yeah, exactly. I mean, for those smaller jobs, yeah, why not just sit down and have a coffee, or ask some questions. I mean, what you’re doing is creating a really good platform for people to get some pretty good advice for no cost. You know, there are platforms out there. And, also, another option in that particular instance, where you are renovating a bathroom, or you’re doing minor works. If you’ve seen an architect or you’ve involved other consultants, why don’t you ask them?

– I mean, they do it every day.

– They do it every day.

– So, you want to be speaking to people at the cold phase.

– I agree with that, yeah.

– Excellent. Starting your property journey. I know you’ve started your property journey, Matt. Because we were lucky enough to have your brother, Adam… If anyone recognizes the last name, then you’ll see that we had Adam, head of commercial sales at Ray White Broadwich in, at the very start of our process. And, he let me in on some secrets. I know that you’ve started your property journey, of course, working and owning your own property. So, for those that need some tips or helpful advice for starting their property journey, and looking for what it is that will get them off the ground, what would you recommend is good ways to get their foot in the door?

– I take a very holistic approach to it.

– Okay, there’s a line.

– I say work backwards. So, with the Concept of patience in mind, just forecast five, 10, 15, 20 years out, and work backwards.

– Beautiful, do your homework, and do your planning. Okay, yeah, tell me more.

– Well, I think… All right, you’ve got your numbers, but work backwards, don’t look at starting your property journey with the concept of five years in mind because the reality is that where you are in your career, or your job is going to be different, in five year, or 10 years. For me, personally, I was pretty adamant I wanted to start my business. So, the fact that I always had that at the back of my mind, that actually stopped me from… Obviously, I got into the market, but I didn’t go and over-leverage or extend myself, or go and buy up a couple more properties, because I was adamant that I already had mapped everything out, and I knew that at a certain point in time, I was going to start my own business. What I do see is a lot of young people go out, and just go bang, bang, bang, bang, bang, bang. And, if the suits your overall plan, then great, but I would say…

– Have that plan forecasted out to that timeline, because yeah, if you want… I mean, if you’re starting your property journey, it more likely that you’re looking for a capital gain, than an income from that property. So then you would assume that if you’re looking 20 years ahead, that’s where you’re going to get the best capital gain from your property, as opposed to looking five years ahead, where the market may be in a worse spot than when you bought it, instead of on the way back up to the saving grace.

– Yeah, but I think everything’s got to… You got to look at your personal situations. So, you’ve got to look at your income, how much spare cash have you got, how much cash have you got to put into the property? How much pressure is that going to put on you? I think there’s a number of factors. I guess what I’m simply trying to say is don’t look at… It’s not a one size fits all scenario. You need to look at your personal circumstances, your personal aspirations, and where you see yourself going in five, 10, 15, 20, and then… It like any big business deal. We’re selling to guys I work with. They don’t just go onto projects for any rhyme or reason, everything is quite meticulously planned out. And, I guess, I’ve seen that work really well, and I think the same sort of concept, a long-term view, can be applied to…

– I think so, I really believe that properties, it’s a…

– It’s a long-term game.

– It’s a long vision thing.

– It is, it’s a long-term game. So, when you’re playing a long-term game, what you need is patience.

– Which is very difficult.

– very difficult. And I’m not saying don’t go and do it, and I’m not saying… All I’m simply saying is instead of you buying a property every year, you might decide to buy every two years, in your overall strategy, or if you’re really wanting to get into the market now, it may be better for you to save up for an extra six, 12 or 18 months, and then buy it, depending on what your overall plan is. So, in the scheme of things, one or two years isn’t going to make a difference, in my view, because it’s the long-term game. In the end, you’ve just got to be patient.

– I agree with you, Matt, that’s very good advice. We like to try and keep things as succinct as possible, and if we can do sort of like a top three tips kind of thing that’s what we try and do. It can be four, it can be five, as long as they’re useful. So, we’ll try to do these top three tips, starting for people building their first home, what would be your top three tips. With the project manager hat on…

– And what I’ve seen.

– And what you’ve seen, what you’ve experienced, what would be your three tips to help them along the path?

– The first tip, straight out, is contracts.

– Beautiful, it’s a good one.

– Get your construction contract right. I think any job where I’ve ended up involved in, any job that’s gone really wrong, where’s it’s just been a really bad experience for all parties and it’s got legal and everything like that, it’s been because the contract’s been wrong. So, stay away, if you’re a first-time buyer, stay away from a cost plus contract.

– Sorry, what is a cost plus?

– You’ve got fixed lump sum contract, where you agree to a fixed price, and a cost plus is sort of like a do and charge type of contract.

– Oh, okay. Very good advice. If you can, stay away from it.

– Well, just, yeah, stay away.

– Full stop.

– Just full stop, yeah. From what I’ve seen. There’s a lot of different types of contracts. Again, I’m very biased in my view because I’ve seen a lot, and I always see things when they go really wrong.

– That’s why you’re here, because you’ve seen it before.

– So, try and stick with the Australian standard suite of contracts.

– And they’ll be supplied by any builder, or any solicitor would be able to assist you in that process.

– Yeah, and that’s a good point, as well. If you are going into your first time, just get your solicitor for 500 or 1000 bucks, or whatever it costs, just get a solicitor review the contract.

– Because it’s worth it in the long-run.

– Absolutely, yeah.

– Excellent

– 100 percent. That’s my biggest tip. If you can kind of apply that, it’s going to save. It is going to save some of you and yours a lot of money. Then, I guess my second tip was try and individualize your house.

– Okay, yup.

– Try and individualize your house. So, what I see a lot is… A house is really fixed in terms of there’s your bedroom, bathroom. It’s a fixed layout, and if you go onto a vaster subdivision, the overall finish and everything looks kind of–

– Standard.

– Standard. So, if you are going into your first house, what I’ve seen is that if you individualize it, your house is going to actually stand out, and you might get some intrinsic value there.

– The only thing that we’ve got done with the cabinets, but within–

– Inside the house, I’m talking about.

– Inside the house, yeah, I agree. If you can make it unique to you, don’t be afraid I think, as well, to then ask those questions of the builder. If they say, “No, that’s how we do it.” then you can say, “Well, let’s try and discuss “ways that we can do it a bit differently, “because this is what I want.” And don’t be afraid to have that conversation.

– I mean, it is your house, you’re spending a lot of money, you are the customer. I do think that gets lost sometimes.

– Yeah, it can.

– It does get lost. We’re trying to apply the same principal at the moment to a couple of residential buildings that we’re doing, inside the units. So, we’re looking at things that are slightly different.

– The off-the-wall, or not what they’ll find around them.

– Yeah, and you’d be surprised once you do your research, it’s still affordable.

– How possible things are.

– Yeah, exactly. But no, , as well.

– Excellent, that’s a good tip. And is there a third one, snuck in there?

– There is, yeah. So I’ve learned at a young age, one of my mentors has always said, “The art of mastering successful project or development “is to spend the money where it counts.” So, prime example of that is instead of spending 100 dollars a square meter on carpet or tiles or whatever, just spend the money where it counts. So, you might just spend the money on a really cool benchtop in the kitchen, or a really nice white fitting or fixture, or a nice feature wall. So, you’re not spending money to upgrade the entire house, but you’re spending it in key areas or on key items, when you’re building your house.

– That’s a really good point.

– And that’s the logic we apply in the commercial projects, right? We keep a standard… A good quality tile or something, throughout the project, but yeah, we’ll go and spend money on a really nice benchtop, that really stands out in the kitchens and the bathrooms, and just really simple stuff like that.

– I like to think, because I’m in the middle, almost finished the renovation on my own house, and that’s the adage that a wise project manager, another person we had on before, said, “James, how long’s the piece of string, mate?” You gotta focus and just choose the things that count. So, I focused on the areas that I spent a lot of time, which is the kitchen, in case you haven’t noticed, and the master bedroom, en suite, the bathroom. Because I do like to be comfortable, I spent time in there grooming, and being pressured. And we agree, wholeheartedly, I think that’s fantastic.

– Another way to look at it is get your project on budget, or just under budget, and go back and look at…

– Then focus and do special orders?

– Because again, this is quite tied in with the second tip I gave, but you’re trying to create a point of difference between your property and someone else. So, when you do go and sell it, again, you’ve got an advantage over the other properties in the area, or the units in the building. And, if you’re trying to rent it, you might get slightly higher rent from it.

– Very good point.

– That’s just some things I’ve picked up on over the years.

– Beautiful, another top three. What are your top three tips… Obviously, everything you say is gold, but what are your top three tips for people identifying their first property? So, this is a little bit out of the realm that you normally specialize in, because you find your way in once the property is likely been identified, but what would be some good advice for people when they’re trying to identify where their home’s going to be?

– Yeah, this is my QS background of financial planning, it’s going to be pretty heavily swayed to that, because that’s where I think.

– That’s great advice. And there are many people like you in this world.

– Yeah, just understand your budget.

– Beautiful.

– And again, like I said before, work backwards. Don’t work forwards, work backwards, understand your budget and work backwards. So, by that I mean by understanding your budget you can then work backwards to understand what your deposit is, what your costs are gonna be, what’s the weekly, monthly costs of the property, how much do you earn, do you have basically enough money every month to pay that off, and still have a good life? That would be one of my tips.

– If you see, you’ve gone to your broker, you know that you’ve got 550 at your top, and you’re looking at properties for 620, 650, then you’ll only be burnt out and disappointed, because those properties just weren’t falling in your category.

– Yeah, but also, if you’re topping out at 550, for example, well should you go for 550?

– Good answer. A conservative, I love it.

– Well, I’ve seen it when things go…

– Yeah, no, correct, it’s a whole thing.

– That’s the way I think…

– Be conservative, if you can. Especially on your first property because if you’re going to make mistakes, which you make mistakes in every walk of life, it’s better to make them small early.

– Yeah, correct. If we look at what’s happening now on the market with interest rates potentially dropping again, the cost of finance is going to be…

– It should be cheaper.

– Should be cheaper.

– I’m a bit skeptical. The only reason I’m skeptical is because banks borrow money, from somebody first.

– Yup, that’s true.

– Sometimes I don’t think they even care what the RBA says. But the sentiment is right, because you’re thinking the same way that your competitor’s thinking, exactly the way you should be thinking, because then if you know more, then you can find a way around. It’s very good advice. The budget then the working backwards.

– Yeah, and I guess with that, it’s like with any financial model we do, we run sensitivities, right? So, if you’re getting your interest rate at 4% now, well where’s that going to be in three to five, 10 years time, right? So, I know when I first bought my property, it would be paying seven, seven and a half percent. Here right now, interest rates are 4% or something.

– Well, I’m seeing 5, 5 and a half, but understood. Wherever they are at this time…

– They’re not going to stay here forever. So, if you go in and you’re on a shoestring budget, and interest rates go up…

– You’re really tight. And if you’ve bought at 550, when all you could afford was 550, then you’ll probably get caught.

– Yeah, and again, let’s just look at it from a perspective of a long-term view. You know, five, 10, 15, 20.

– Beautiful, what would be number two? Not that they’re in any priority order, by the way, but…

– No, I guess the second point I’d make, is like we’ve already touched on, but is don’t overcommit.

– Yeah, very good point.

– Equity is key, so property is long-term game, and you want to stay in the game long-term, right? So, that means making smart, strategic moves. And that also means you’re not going to build your empire over night. So, equity’s key, cash is king, that’s what I learned, especially going through the GFC, and seeing firsthand what happened. The guys who had equity, the guys who had cash, prospered during those years. So, you remember that it’s a long-term game, so you’re going to have good times and bad times, throughout your property careers. So, you want to really be in a good equity position. So, yeah, that would be my advice.

– That’s great. Can we sneak a third in there, Matty?

– Like we spoke about earlier, I think looking at ways to do things different and add value. So, If you’re buying an existing property, yeah, just have a look at where you could add. Can you knock a wall down to include a living area, or enclose an area to create an extra bedroom? You know, look at easy ways to add value.

– Yeah, I like it. There’s a lot of commercially-minded advice in that, because I assume you’re leaving it up to the member to know, “Well, I want to live near that dog park in this area, “near my parents, or near my uncles and aunties.” So, the area, the location they’ve got covered, but some of these things they may not be thinking about. So, very, very good advice.

– And look, if you’ve got an area in mind… If you’ve got an ideal location, just remember, you can build up to that location. So, you can buy a property not in that location, with the intention of getting to your ideal location…

– As a stepping stone.

– As a stepping stone. If it’s going to make things easier, and not put so much pressure on you, so, yeah.

– Beautiful, that’s very good advice. Top tips, so we haven’t put a number on this one. Top tips, things that you wish you knew when starting out as a project manager, which I think it be helpful for people at home because they’re trying to think of ways that they can be different to the person around them, and get the property that they want, or look at property in a different way. So, what would be those things you wish you knew when you started out?

– Mate, a big one for me is being patient.

– Yeah, beautiful.

– Yeah, and I think that’s lost, too. I’ve learned, well I’m learning at the moment, that patience is key. And, again, I’m lucky enough that I’ve learned from some really successful people. I’ve been really lucky to work with some really successful property investors and developers. So, I guess, if I had to summarize their key attributes, they’re all patient, and they all play that long-term game, I mentioned already.

– I hear you on that.

– It’s just key.

– Solid information.

– You making a really quick decision, or you making a spur of the moment decision, has consequences, and can bite you later on. So, I can’t tell you how many times patience has paid off for me.

– And I feel in this game, the opportunities never last forever.

– No, there’s opportunities.

– There’s so many opportunities that you think, well, you’ll never get this again.

– No

– You will. Something else will come up that is almost the same opportunity, it’s just wrapped in a different clothing. Correct, and by you saying no to this opportunity, you’re actually creating space for that other opportunity.

– That’s a fantastic way of looking at it, a very balanced way of looking at it.

– I mean, like you say, property is a game for some, and it’s a long-term game. Yeah, so patience is a big one. Immersing yourself in the knowledge, right? So, read books, get other people’s point of views, understand that you don’t have to agree with them all the time, but just immerse yourself in the knowledge, and then find what resonates with you, after you’ve immersed… I think rather than going out, thinking you know what you’re doing, I always will have five or six… I’ll be working closely with five or six different clients at any one time, they’ve all got their different views on the way that things are. So, I always listen to them, and try and understand where they’re coming from, and immerse myself in their knowledge, because then you can find what resonates with you, and then apply that. And you’ll find that you’ll be more passionate when you do it that way.

– Because you’re really, you’re picking up, as an analogy, you’re trying to pick up all these jigsaw pieces, and then put it all together in your own mind.

– Yeah, but what works for you and what works for me is two different things. Your circumstances are different, your long-term goals are different to me. So, what resonates with me may not resonate with you, and there might be a good reason for that. So, it’s not a one size fits all.

– But, to understand your reasons as to why you’re thinking the way you’re thinking may help me think in a way that improves my thinking.

– 100 percent, yeah. 100 percent, mate, 100%.

– So, listening. Very, very important. And it’s taking those pieces of knowledge on board, and not being too proud to sort of walk in a room and know you’re not the guy that knows everything, or not the person that knows everything.

– No, and that was a big one for me, because there’s other people in the room feeling exactly the way you are. And when I got that… Do you know you walk into a room, and people are talking, and you go, “Hang on, I don’t actually understand “what’s being discussed here.” You kind of feel like, you know, you’re not…

– I walk up behind them and start laughing, and then… Those people, and see if they’ll let me talk to them.

– Yeah, but people are feeling exactly the same way that you are in that meeting. So, if you’re in a meeting, and that’s what I have found in the industry, is that it’s okay not to know something.

– Yeah, ask questions.

– Ask questions, yeah.

– 100 percent, that is fantastic. And how much we’ve learned so far. We’ll never know everything, you’ll never know everything.

– Find a mentor, as well, and just don’t be afraid to ask the question. One thing that’s working for me is I’ll ask, if I’m not sure about something, I’ll ask three different people their opinion on it. I’ll talk it out with them, like if it’s a really big decision. So, if you are buying your first house, and it’s a big decision for you and you’re putting a lot of money on the line, or it’s a second investment, whatever it is. Ask three different people, or find a mentor, and talk it out with them. What I find is there will be certain things that come up in each conversation that’ll be relatively the same, and…

– String them together.

– And you string them together, and it generally leads you to a common answer. And, that’s something I’ve learned that works really well.

– That’s very wise. All of this in only 12 years.

– A lot of mistakes.

– Good point, best way to learn. Thank you. Matt, thank you very, very much for you time, it’s been an absolute pleasure talking to you. This is been some fantastic advice from Matt. Make sure you hope onto Mrkts group if you need to hear a bit more. Hopefully Matty will find his way on there, and be able to contribute, as well. Thank you so much for your time. If you want the full video, it will be made available on the website, or through other means. Thank you for your time, and we’ll get back to you very soon, talking so some more brilliant people. Hopefully as good as this was, so thank you Matt, again.

– Thanks mate, I appreciate it. Thanks buddy

– Beautiful.

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